all 168 comments

[–]chairmobile 260 points261 points  (73 children)

Don't ever fucking post this shit on your wall. Dumb fucking thing to do.

There is absolutely 0 point to discussion or "discourse" or whatever the fuck sjw's call it. No conversation is going to alter the intertia of decades of life experience and circlejerking.

You will only lose friends and come off as a "omg creepy mra lol he thinks men have it bad or something lol we go gurll"

[–]AlchemyPhoenix 56 points57 points  (17 children)

I'm quickly coming around to your way of thinking. It wasn't even so much for selfish, get-laid reasons (I knew it wasn't contributing to that,) but for a long time I genuinely had the ambition to try to get people to just be a bit more empathetic of what it's like to be someone else, including both pissed off, loser BPers who called women bitches and whores, and feminists who pouted about male privilege. I thought I was making the world a better place. Turns out no one gives a shit. People want to be miserable and feel sorry for themselves. They will come looking for us when they are tired of remaining on the same shit carousel.

[–]16 Endorsed ContributorTRPsubmitter[S] 44 points45 points  (10 children)

I never ever bring this stuff up unprovoked. But I'll drop it (without the Redpill terminology) if I see it come up.

I've posted "Actually, that's not true (link to an article)" and just left it at that. You'll get more support than you think, at least from guys.

Let the article's criticism do the work for you.

[–]RPModulator 22 points23 points  (2 children)

A subtle response is probably ok. But I think /u/chairmobile is right, caution is warranted. Don't ever forget, we are subversives, and will be treated as such, if discovered. Or, as R. Greene says . . .

Law 38: Think as you like but behave like others: "If you make a show of going against the times, flaunting your unconventional ideas and unorthodox way, people will think that you only want attention and that you look down upon them.They will find away to punish you for making them feel inferior. It is far safer to blend in and nurture the common touch. Share your originality only with tolerant friends and those who are sure to appreciate your uniqueness.”

[–]krakosia 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Look up what you can't say by Paul Graham. It is a great essay by the founder of ycombinator and it covers a bit of the above but at a much broader level

[–]52576078 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Wish I'd learned this 20 years ago! :-/

[–]obsidian_pill 26 points27 points  (6 children)

Hey just think about it this way, if a child starts an argument with you, will you pull up your arsenal of scientific papers and academic articles that disprove his ideology?

No, you say this kid doesn't know any better and i'm not going to waste my time trying to make him/her/it understand.

Similarly, such SJW are beyond the point of return. When you say, "never bring it up unprovoked"...well that is what they feed off of. They provoke you with their bullshit and expect to get a reaction.

Don't feed the femmies.

[–]Jack41096 22 points23 points  (3 children)

most of them don't appear to have any problems being fed.

[–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 5 points6 points  (2 children)

Other than being fed too much without enough exercise.

[–]87GNX 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Right... that's what he was getting at.

[–]1 Endorsed Contributorvandaalen 0 points1 point  (1 child)

That depends heavily on whose childvit is...

[–]obsidian_pill 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Well, problem solved then. Unless its your child, you should not engage in arguments with idiots to prove your point.

[–][deleted] 22 points23 points  (5 children)

My take on this phenomena is a little mental ideology I call "The High Road"

As a blue eyed 6'5'' college educated white male from a middle class family, the whole world seems to think that my life has been easy, even though my life has been anything but.

My dad is a hateful bastard that bailed on me for another family he started once my parents split, my mother is a drug addict/alcoholic sociopath who attempted suicide in her room during my 10th birthday party that was going on in the next room (the first time cops showed up to one of my parties haha)

Anyway, the point is, people in life are always trying to look for things to blame their failures on, it's a mental battle we all struggle with. This mentality can manifest itself in people who look at someone successful like myself and their insecure egos will start coming up with reasons that you have succeeded in places that they have failed. This tends to happen most with minorities, women and short men.

I tried for years explaining this concept to people, and in the end it made me more enemies than anything else. So the best thing you can do is take the high road. People will hate you for just being you, and what it really comes down to is jealousy. So if they really think your life is so grand, then fuck em, be a smug son of a bitch and let them. But keep it to yourself, and don't think you'll win any hearts by opening up about it to people.

[–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 13 points14 points  (4 children)

I'm a short bastard and I agree with you. Some shit would come easier to you, some easier to me, my life isn't yours and vice versa. Some shit is hard for both of us.

I grew up in a shithole of a life and family. They held me down, abused and neglected me, treated me like shit, and now thirty years after leaving they still blame me for shit that happened to me, that they did. I overcame everything they threw in my path, struggled for years against the tide, and I have become a strong son of a bitch.

If you want to get faster, you can pull a weighted sled, the effort will make you stronger because its harder. They put a damn heavy sled behind me, and my mental image still has it back there so I tend to go too far with some things, and not far enough with others, that is shit I have to work on, removing the mental road blocks holding me back.

They didn't make us stronger, you and I did that despite their efforts to fuck us over. The credit is ours because we put in the work. Just because they made it harder doesn't earn them a fucking thing, but we used it to improve far beyond what they have done. Our lives made us who we are to a certain extent, but we made ourselves into who we are by a far larger margin.

Fuck them.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Cheers man

The strongest steel is forged in the hottest flame

[–]Stopher 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Then again, all else equal, I'd rather be the "6'5 blue eyed guy" with the shitty family than the "short bastard" with the shitty family.

[–]MrMagwitch 0 points1 point  (1 child)

.

[–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours -1 points0 points  (0 children)

That I am not alone, that my experience is in no way unique, pisses me off more than having had to live through it. Its common, almost expected, and of course they will blame you for it. If it was just me, then its something I have to deal with, but it happens constantly and if you fight back you are a criminal.

I wish I was alone in this, but I'm not. I'd rather nobody else ever endure the shit I've been through. Not going to happen though, because people are violent, self absorbed, self centered assholes at their best.

[–]2 Endorsed ContributorFLFTW16 11 points12 points  (5 children)

People tend to forget that the West is a totalitarian state system. What? Did I just say that? Yes. Only in a totalitarian system are people controlled so completely, so absolutely that even thoughts are policed. Since they can't access our thoughts directly (thank God), they wait until some dumb sonofabitch says something out loud. If it is possible they will go after him legally to take away his bodily freedom. If that is not possible they will go after him economically and ruin his business or his employer's business until he is made unemployed and potentially unemployable.

I used to think the U.S. was a free place. That was because I was blue pill, liberal, progressive. Even when I thought it was a free place I still supported the lynch mobs against people who thought differently. I still cheered on the pogroms against people who didn't believe what I believed in.

Now I know better. Now I know that there is no freedom. Universities are not places for debate or the cultivation of ideas, they are factories for brainwashing. If you don't spit out the "correct" beliefs on cue, you will draw suspicion and anger.

We used to think conservatives were fascist in nature. Nah. It's liberals and progressives that truly wish to kowtow to authority and turn off their brains. Feel free to disagree with me, that's one right you will always have inside the manosphere/TRP.

[–]krakosia 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Look up panopticon, that is what facebook is

[–]chairmobile 2 points3 points  (0 children)

No, I totally agree.

I dislike conservatives because a lot of their positions are just dumb, but at least they're somewhat ideologically cohesive.

Fuck liberals.They are cancer who haven't learned to look at the world themselves.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (2 children)

See, you're just another example of someone who could have otherwise objective and rational thought that is instead clouded by political ideology.

Take a step back, and look at it from a perspective of animal behavior. Don't read too much into it, and contemplate it from an evolutionary standpoint.

Social animals are punished when they stray from the herd. This is the nature of things. Just because our current herd is going in one direction, it doesn't mean picking a new direction will change anything about the herd, it just means things will look a little different.

People talk about freedom vs fascism all the time, but the truth is that freedom is the boundary of what the leadership/authoritarians will tolerate, fascism is the boundary of what the followers/workers will tolerate. We impose both on ourselves and each other as a survival mechanism. It has absolutely nothing to do with liberal vs conservative.

[–]fortifiedoranges -1 points0 points  (1 child)

Liberalism is the antithesis of TRP. The two ideologies are on opposite ends of the spectrum.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Liberalism is the antithesis of your ideology.

TRP is about the sexual marketplace. It is about how to increase your SMV, how to become more dominant, and about self improvement.

Those who seek to make it about politics, about being anti-woman, or anti-feminism, are simply falling into an emotional pitfall that will keep them from seeing things objectively. If you really follow the teachings, you'll find that the ideal redpiller will be apolitical, non-religious, and devoid of emotional investment in anything but themselves. They will see a system, and they will not try to change, but instead discover how to game it.

If you want to see it as something else, you are welcome to, and I will be there to take advantage of your simple mind by feeding you bullshit for breakfast a la Ayn Rand, Rand Paul, and Rush Limbaugh, profiteers that have learned how to game the political system.

[–]Endorsed Contributorleftajar 12 points13 points  (3 children)

YES. For the love of god, DO NOT put this on your wall.

That sort of thing could damage your career. Seriously, don't talk about TRP. There's a reason it's called the red pill: most people just can't handle it.

[–]muyuu 11 points12 points  (4 children)

Having a "personal FB" is a dumb fucking thing to do. FB is for PR, not for personal use.

[–]drimadethistocomment 5 points6 points  (1 child)

I always hear this spouted as if it's TRP cannon. I rarely, if ever, post anything on my wall anymore. It's mostly my spot to catch up with old friends these days. College was a while ago and I still like to keep up with some of my bros. We may not sit and chat all the time, but it's nice to hear from them when we do speak.

[–]muyuu 2 points3 points  (0 children)

And this is fine as long as you keep in mind this is purely a PR facade. These people know you and don't need you to be posting personal shit in your wall.

If you mix flings with real friends with fuckbuddies in your FB and post divisive/sensible stuff you are a complete moron. Between that and using it to pass around a message or two, or not having a FB account at all, there are many shades of grey.

[–]icallmyselfmonster 5 points6 points  (0 children)

I recently deleted my Facebook account, the full delete.

You simply don't need an online presence in this way. I could write an essay on how bad Facebook is.it's detrimental to use in any form .

[–]chairmobile -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

I use FB to communicate with my friends.

Sorry, am I a horrible person now?

[–]anonlymouse 2 points3 points  (8 children)

You will only lose friends and come off as a "omg creepy mra lol he thinks men have it bad or something lol we go gurll"

Have lost exactly zero friends posting this kind of stuff, and in fact gained some through the arguments I had.

[–]chairmobile -2 points-1 points  (7 children)

"My grandfather was a chain smoker and he lived till 85, so smoking is cool right?".

That's what you sound like right now.

It's a general warning. Of course there will be exceptions depending on one's friend circle but in general it's a dumb thing to do.

[–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (6 children)

Nah, what you're saying is "I lost friends like this, so you shouldn't try it, because obviously your friends are exactly like mine." On top of it, who gives a fuck if you do lose a couple friends like this?

[–]chairmobile 0 points1 point  (5 children)

  1. It's good to have a diversity of opinion in a friends circle

  2. I judge my friends by intelligence, loyalty, how interesting they are, and how well we get along, not "omg his worldview is slightly different than mine next hurr durr"

  3. Most of my friends would, though pretty bluepill/liberal, not respond negatively towards this kind of post. However, there's no point to any of this shit and it can only piss people off, so why try?

  4. I'm betting that most people have friends circles that aren't fully compromised of redpill type people. That's the null hypothesis, not "let's start by assuming that every one of your friends is red pill pro-mra anti-feminist non-progressive okay? Okay".

[–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (4 children)

1 and 2, sure. 3, no. There is a point to it; correcting misperceptions. 4. Irrelevant bet, because that environment doesn't mean you'll lose friends by discussing it.

[–]chairmobile -1 points0 points  (3 children)

What net good does correcting misperceptions do?

None of these people will be policy makers or senators (they're doing better things with their lives than wasting themselves on politics), so who gives a shit what they think?

If you think the people have jack power in this country think again lol.

[–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (2 children)

They will be voters, and there are some very close electoral races. Some of them will also start talking to others and changing their minds.

[–]chairmobile -2 points-1 points  (1 child)

Implying any political candidate ever will support tp tenets with a huge female majority voter base

Implying people have any say over what our shit government does

Implying the nation isn't run by a massive majority of idiots

Voting is is a waste of time bro

[–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (0 children)

There are plenty who already do.

There are limits, but we still have a say.

If they really were stupid, they wouldn't be where they are now. Disagreeing with you doesn't make them stupid.

It's not a waste of time at all, but go ahead, keep hamstering your laziness.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Yeah, I made the mistake of doing that by writing an essay with the prompt, "Men's Rights are Human Rights". Received 70% because my teacher was too thick-skulled to understand my explanations about traditionalism, and how females were never oppressed.

Now I'm known in my school as a woman hater, even some guys think I'm a misogynist because I care about men, like it's a crime to be pro-male.

[–]chairmobile 0 points1 point  (3 children)

Yup.

"Show, don't tell" applies to life almost everywhere.

I wouldn't be caught dead talking about my real political opinions/worldviews in real life. Whenever anyone asks, I either pretend to not know anything or just spout whatever the leftist PC line is at the time.

[–]AlchemyPhoenix 1 point2 points  (1 child)

Only problem is that the MRAs are right about one thing: if it ever gets so bad that the tumblrinas start to actually bend the ears of Washington, then we really will need to decide to either sacrifice our comfort and fight back vocally, or else accept that the laws will shift toward the more vociferous single-issue voters. I for one would start shedding friends left and right if that's what it took to prevent the "Written Contract Before Sex or Else Five Years in Prison Act of 2019" from being passed.

[–]52576078 0 points1 point  (0 children)

But they already have Washington's ear. Obama came out with the 77c pay myth, and California just came out with the "Yes means yes" thing, so it has already started. This is what concerns me - at some point, someone has to be brave enough to stand up, and say enough.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Same here. At least it was some essay in Grade 11 (dropped my History mark by 7%, but I still managed a half-way decent grade). I learned my lesson, and will be the most yuppie leftist feminist in University when it comes to essays about Humanity, depending of course, on the professor's views on the matter.

However, when I finally get to where I want to get, I will have the power to strike out and influence this world...then I'll do all that I can to make sure that the blue-pill is smashed in public, for all men to see, only then will this world be able to move forward...

[–]theonlymikeonreddit 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I have tried to persuade many blue pill guys I know into this way of thinking. It is a tough pill to swallow, too much for most, I have to present the information, only when a broken blue pill becomes willing, otherwise I am just wasting my time.

I will say that rape is used constantly, to attempt sympathy from me. This is a reoccurring theme. Learning to combat this is one of the tougher aspects of TRP.

[–]Aphrodite_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I completely agree with you. I think doing that will also trigger a Streisand effect which femitards will use for their benefit.

[–]Iupvoteforknowledge -2 points-1 points  (19 children)

This. It's like trying to use logic with creationists. It's just not gonna happen and you are going to lose friends. People can only change themselves.

[–]sonicdrumm80 3 points4 points  (18 children)

Not true, I'm a creationist who swallowed TRP.

[–]val-amart 3 points4 points  (17 children)

congrats, but this doesn't mean you can follow logic. you even neglected logic in the post you replied to, thus confirming his statement.

[–]sonicdrumm80 0 points1 point  (16 children)

the point wasn't to acknowledge the point or dismiss it, merely that there are those of us who are creationists who can and do use logic.

[–]GhostRider22 3 points4 points  (4 children)

You can not be a creationist, and claim to follow logic. These are two mutually exclusive things.

[–]sonicdrumm80 -1 points0 points  (3 children)

I would disagree, and as you cannot prove how they are divorced, I see no reason why this discussion should go any further.

[–]GhostRider22 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Creationism is a belief system not based on observation. That is directly counter to logic and observation.

The fact you can't even follow this simple discussion shows you have absolutely no grasp of logic.

[–]SolidSolution -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It's not our job to prove they are different. The difference is clear; one is based on faith, the other is based on observation. If anything, it's up to you to prove how they are they are similar. So... can you?

[–]Iramohs 3 points4 points  (9 children)

If you're a creationist by definition you reject logic. You believe a book compiled by some guys 1500 years ago at a committee meeting has every answer you've ever wanted.

[–]sonicdrumm80 0 points1 point  (8 children)

And what do you believe in?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

What can be observed.

Believing in anything else is only there for your comfort. Comfort is the enemy of TRP.

[–]Endless_Summer -1 points0 points  (6 children)

Infinite universal randomness.

[–]sonicdrumm80 1 point2 points  (4 children)

Ok, notice I have no need to ridicule your beliefs.

[–]Endless_Summer -1 points0 points  (3 children)

Umm, ok guy... Don't know why you would in the first place.

[–][deleted]  (3 children)

[deleted]

    [–]1bicepsblastingstud 5 points6 points  (1 child)

    A nice thought, but it's foolish. Guard your reputation. You have no idea what ripples may come from an action like that.

    [–]52576078 0 points1 point  (0 children)

    Agree. I used be like Cassial and always spoke my mind. It gets you nothing but trouble.

    [–]chairmobile 1 point2 points  (0 children)

    I have plenty of friends who are great guys, very supportive/helpful/fun, but can be bluepill at times.

    Not all of your friends have to subscribe to your exact worldview. It's good to have a diversity of opinion/thought.

    Moreover, my family etc. would not approve of me being cast in with the MRA lot. It's simply not worth it to post any shit like this. It's just attention whoring at the end of the day; nobody of importance or in a place of power will ever read what you put on your wall.

    [–]Surf_Or_Die 25 points26 points  (5 children)

    "this left the door open for anyone who regretted a sexual liaison to be counted as a rape victim, even if neither partner thought of the situation as abusive."

    I've been raped.

    [–]VaginalFungus 8 points9 points  (1 child)

    Me too. Let's start a club.

    [–]ChuckBlizzy 5 points6 points  (0 children)

    Yeah me too, obviously. If you don't have at least one drunk hook up that you regret, in my opinion, you didn't drink enough in college.

    [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

    The sad thing is womyn's thought processs when reading this be like "Was I raped?" "Oh my God I was raped!"

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]zlex 14 points15 points  (0 children)

      I did some IT contracting work a few years ago for a mental hospital, specifically in the women's mental health unit helping researchers doing data acquisition. By and large the vast majority of rapes from that population were committed by a family member or someone close to the victim. Very few rapes were committed by a stranger, and even less were committed only once. Rape claims from one-night stands, etc., were by and large fringe events, which makes this intense focus on stranger-danger rape seem totally out of place. Given the serious and intense mental damage that this form of abuse causes, it seems very unlikely that 1/5 women have been raped. Generally it is a form of long-term abuse where the victim is raped repeatedly by someone they know.

      [–]BluepillProfessor 39 points40 points  (16 children)

      Here is the truth:

      MORE MEN ARE RAPED IN THE UNITED STATES THAN WOMEN.

      Except it is something we laugh and hoot about- don't bend over to pick up the soap.

      We don't include the prison rape statistics in the "rape" statistics.

      Who cares? They are just prisoners. They DESERVED it, right? That was part of their punishment!

      [–]anonlymouse 7 points8 points  (1 child)

      If you compare the 2010 and 2011 CDC stats, more men per capita are raped in the US than women, and that's without prison rape stats (which I've only found for 2009, so can't be compared properly).

      [–]Urist_McPOE 10 points11 points  (4 children)

      Do you have any evidence to support that statement? It may be true, but until I see a proper source backing it up your rape factoid holds as much water as the 1 in 5 women one.

      [–]1 Endorsed Contributorvandaalen 4 points5 points  (3 children)

      [–]anonlymouse -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

      Sorry for Daily Shit Link.

      Don't apologise for stuff like that, shows the feminists are still getting to you.

      [–]1 Endorsed Contributorvandaalen 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      Wat? What has the shit-hole Daily Mail got to do with feminazis?

      I truly apologize from my heart for providing it as a source, because I was too lazy searching for a more reliable source like the source study.

      [–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      That it's considered a shit hole is a belief propagated by feminists. TDM is willing to write about controversial issues and won't toe the line, so to avoid having to address anything, they'll just criticise the source. Your apology means feminism still has a hold on you.

      [–]ThreadPill 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      That may be true, but it doesn't really help our case. All it says is men are unbiased rapists.

      [–]100 Modbsutansalt 8 points9 points  (1 child)

      In addition to the 1 in 5 canard, I was reminded of the "every 9 seconds a woman is assaulted by her partner" factoid by a guest on the Tom Leykis show yesterday. IF that 9 second figure is correct, then men are assaulted by their partners even more frequently given the fact women commit reciprocal domestic violence as often as men do, and commit 70% of unilateral domestic violence. Do NOT let that "every 9 seconds" bullshit fly without pointing this out.

      Sources:

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1854883/

      Results. Almost 24% of all relationships had some violence, and half of those were reciprocally violent. In nonreciprocally violent relationships, women were the perpetrators in more than 70% of the cases. Reciprocity was associated with more frequent violence among women. Regarding injury, men were more likely to inflict injury than were women, and reciprocal intimate partner violence was associated with greater injury than was nonreciprocal intimate partner violence regardless of the gender of the perpetrator.

      http://www.csulb.edu/~mfiebert/assault.htm

      SUMMARY: This bibliography examines 286 scholarly investigations: 221 empirical studies and 65 reviews and/or analyses, which demonstrate that women are as physically aggressive, or more aggressive, than men in their relationships with their spouses or male partners. The aggregate sample size in the reviewed studies exceeds 371,600.

      For example:

      Whitaker, D. J., Haileyesus, T., Swahn, M., & Saltzman, L. S. (2007). Differences in frequency of violence and reported injury between relationships with reciprocal and nonreciprocal intimate partner violence. American Journal of Public Health, 97, 941-947. (A sample of 11,370 young adults <46% male, 54% female; 70% white, 15% black, 10.7% Hispanic, 4.3 % other> aged 18-28, who were drawn from the 2001 National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health, responded to a modified version of the CTS. Results indicate that almost 24% of all relationships had some physical violence and that half the violence was reciprocal. In non-reciprocally violent relationships, women were the perpetrators 70% of the time. While overall, women were somewhat more likely to be injured than men, the authors report that, "in fact, men in relationships with reciprocal violence were reportedly injured more often <25.2%> than were women in relationships with nonreciprocal violence <20.0%>.)

      http://ajph.aphapublications.org/doi/abs/10.2105/AJPH.2005.079020

      Results. Almost 24% of all relationships had some violence, and half (49.7%) of those were reciprocally violent. In nonreciprocally violent relationships, women were the perpetrators in more than 70% of the cases. Reciprocity was associated with more frequent violence among women (adjusted odds ratio [AOR]=2.3; 95% confidence interval [CI]=1.9, 2.8), but not men (AOR=1.26; 95% CI=0.9, 1.7). Regarding injury, men were more likely to inflict injury than were women (AOR=1.3; 95% CI=1.1, 1.5), and reciprocal intimate partner violence was associated with greater injury than was nonreciprocal intimate partner violence regardless of the gender of the perpetrator (AOR=4.4; 95% CI=3.6, 5.5)

      Conclusions. The context of the violence (reciprocal vs nonreciprocal) is a strong predictor of reported injury. Prevention approaches that address the escalation of partner violence may be needed to address reciprocal violence.

      http://jiv.sagepub.com/content/2/1/82.abstract

      Some 30% of the men and 32% of the women reported engaging in some form of physical aggression against a current steady dating partner. Additionally, 49% of the men and 26% of the women reported being the victims of their current dating partner's physical aggression. Length of the dating relationship was associated with men's physical aggression and their victimization was associated with decreased liking for their partners. Women's experiences with physical aggression in a dating relationship as both victims and aggressors were related to the length of the relationship, less liking for the partner, and less positive affect for the partner.

      Aizenman, M., & Kelley, G. (1988). The incidence of violence and acquaintance rape in dating relationships among college men and women. Journal of College Student Development, 29, 305-311. (A sample of actively dating college students <204 women and 140 men> responded to a survey examining courtship violence. Authors report that there were no significant differences between the sexes in self reported perpetration of physical abuse.)

      Anderson, K. L. (2002). Perpetrator or victim? Relationships between intimate partner violence and well-being. Journal of Marriage and Family, 64, 851-863. (Data consisted of 7,395 married and cohabiting heterosexual couples drawn from wave 1 of the National Survey of Families and Households <NSFH-1>. In terms of measures: subjects were asked "how many arguments during the past year resulted in 'you hitting, shoving or throwing things at a partner.' They were also asked how many arguments ended with their partner, 'hitting, shoving or throwing things at you.'" Author reports that, "victimization rates are slightly higher among men than women <9% vs 7%> and in cases that involve perpetration by only one partner, more women than men were identified as perpetrators (2% vs 1%)")

      -

      Arias, I., & Johnson, P. (1989). Evaluations of physical aggression among intimate dyads. Journal of Interpersonal Violence, 4, 298-307. (Used Conflict Tactics Scale-CTS- with a sample of 103 male and 99 female undergraduates. Both men and women had similar experience with dating violence, 19% of women and 18% of men admitted being physically aggressive. A significantly greater percentage of women thought self-defense was a legitimate reason for men to be aggressive, while a greater percentage of men thought slapping was a legitimate response for a man or woman if their partner was sexually unfaithful.)

      Arriaga, X. B., & Foshee, V. A. (2004). Adolescent dating violence. Do adolescents follow in their friends' or their parents' footsteps? Journal of Interpersonal Violence, 19, 162-184. (A modified version of Conflict Tactics Scale was administered on two occasions, 6 months apart, to 526 adolescents, <280 girls, 246 boys> whose median age was 13. Results reveal that 28% of girls reported perpetrating violence with their partners <17% moderate, 11% severe> on occasion one, while 42% of girls reported perpetrating violence <25% moderate, 17% severe> on occasion two. For boys, 11% reported perpetrating violence <6% moderate, 5% severe> on occasion one, while 21% reported perpetrating violence <6% moderate, 15% severe> on occasion two. In terms of victimization, 33% of girls, and 38% of boys reported being victims of partner aggression on occasion one and 47% of girls and 49% of boys reported victimization on occasion two.

      You can find more by looking for the phrase 'reciprocal violence'.

      [–]16 Endorsed ContributorTRPsubmitter[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      This is some serious information here.

      [–]WillClickOnAnything 14 points15 points  (8 children)

      If any of you ever catch me engaged in such a discussion with anyone please blow my brains out, quickly. Thanks.

      [–]sir_wankalot_here 10 points11 points  (6 children)

      Most "rape" cases happen because the woman's friends find out she was fucking some loser. That is why when you pick up chicks in bars, seperate from her friends. She won't want to be seen leaving the bar with you.

      If you think she is into you, but she is hesitant. Suggest you leave the bar first and sje follows you in 15 minutes and meets you someplace outside the bar. You then could tell her to say to her friends she is tired, and will just catch a taxi home. Technically she is not lying she just omitted the part that the taxi will also pick you up :-)

      [–]jmg83 6 points7 points  (3 children)

      That happened to my friend. A chick who ended up dating two of my other friends fucked him at a party, then got embarrassed because she knew people would laugh at her for shagging a fat guy, so she made up some rape shit to make herself look good. No one believed her, because A) she's a known liar, B) my friend was far too much of a nerd to initiate anything with a girl. C) He weighed about 20 stone, whereas this girl couldn't possible weigh more that 8. No way in shit was he on top.

      This same girl accused my other fried of beating her when they were together. On the street, near her mother's house, after they argued, she made a production of falling on the ground and yelling "OMG, Alex, why did you hit me?!". It just so happened that one of our buddies was hiding around the corner recording the incident on his phone.

      [–]sir_wankalot_here 7 points8 points  (2 children)

      Your friend was lucky.

      Lets say it was some chick who looked like goody two shoes that is secretly a slut. That is why you always deny deny deny.

      It is amazing how credibility and appearance can effect things. Someone posted an article about how a white guy in NYC wearing an expensive suit was spray painting graphitti. Lots of people where walking by, none of them did anything. A few cops even walked by and did nothing. The big thing is people do not even know they are doing it.

      Rich people think cops are nice to everyone because cops are always helpful to them. Reality is if you are poor and on fire you will be lucky if a cop pisses on you. And then he will probably ticket you for being a dangerous obstruction.

      [–]jmg83 1 point2 points  (1 child)

      Very lucky indeed. That so easily could have gone the other way.

      You're right about the cops. I've been told that I must look suspicious because of the number of times I've been stopped the cops. The most suspicious thing about me is something I can't change, though.

      [–]tallwheel 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      That's good advice, but the message you replied to was referring to avoiding a discussion about rape statistics, not a false rape accusation.

      [–]SolidSolution 2 points3 points  (0 children)

      How about I blow the other guy's brains out? You'll thank me later.

      [–]Endorsed ContributorAFPJ 3 points4 points  (0 children)

      This is illogical hysteria and you can tell any woman who implies otherwise that according to statistics, she'd be safer from rape and violence in any other country than the U.S - including South Africa, Sri Lanka, North Korea, Ethiopia and Burma (don't ever fucking go to Burma). They should move there & be empowered. Anyone perpetuating or believing this broadcasts their intellectual inferiority - do not associate with or attempt to debate trash.

      Or you could jump onto the bandwagon and exploit the movement to gain popularity, repute, favor and power - all for just a few pretty little lies. Join the pro-feminist Machiavellian club and reap the benefits motherfuckers.

      [–]topspeedj 5 points6 points  (1 child)

      I have a degree in mathematics and see some dumb shit everyday. But how does someone logically think that adding those percentages makes any kind of sense?

      [–]1redpillbanana 8 points9 points  (1 child)

      It's true, if 1 in 5 women have been raped, it would be a national emergency to stop rape. They might even declare martial law to stop these millions of rapists who have raped 20% of the country's women.

      The problem with bringing up these kinds of facts and logic in a debate is exemplified in this conversation:

      https://i.imgur.com/qcokrfI.jpg

      “If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn’t value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?” ― Sam Harris

      "I don't give a shit lol" -- Feminist

      [–]svogliate 8 points9 points  (19 children)

      This isn't a topic I want to discuss with anyone. I don't need to know how to debunk it; if someone who is talking with me wants to keep talking about this, they can find someone else to talk to. I have more interesting things to talk about.

      [–]1sailorJery 2 points3 points  (18 children)

      ok but now imagine that you've got a plate spouting this nonsense, it has merit

      [–]Olipyr 4 points5 points  (17 children)

      Then she is no longer worthy of being my plate. Simple and much more effective. Plus, there is a higher chance you'll end up with her begging to have you back.

      [–]1sailorJery 1 point2 points  (16 children)

      you'd ax a girl just because she's misinformed?

      [–]ITHOUGHTYOUMENTWEAST 6 points7 points  (5 children)

      A feminist is an automatic dealbreaker. Don't give a fuck if you are a 10/10 120 pounds DD and cook for a living. If you are a feminist they can walk right the fuck out.

      [–]Mr_Andry 7 points8 points  (0 children)

      I would absolutely leave after eating her fine food and fucking her fine ass.

      [–]chairmobile 2 points3 points  (1 child)

      If any girl was 10/10 120 pounds DD she wouldn't be a feminist.

      [–]ITHOUGHTYOUMENTWEAST 1 point2 points  (0 children)

      Ain't that the truth. Come to think about it I have never seen an attractive feminist.

      [–]SolidSolution 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Being misinformed doesn't necessarily mean she's a feminist. She could have just heard the statistic spouted off from somewhere. I couldn't tell you how many years I believed in the "you eat XX spiders per year in your sleep" nonsense. Before you drop her you should test the waters and see if you can dissuade her of the notion that college campuses have higher rape rates than Detroit. Take control of the situation instead of running the fuck away before she even knows why.

      [–]1sailorJery -4 points-3 points  (0 children)

      You can pass on fucking feminists, that's fine.

      [–]svogliate 2 points3 points  (9 children)

      No, not because she's misinformed; because she is a bore. Who wants to hear about this stuff?

      I don't know, maybe you like talking about this stuff, in that case, feel free. I think managing to have a conversation about this stuff without falling into the trap of arguing with the hamster is a really fine line; it's not one I care to walk.

      [–]1sailorJery -2 points-1 points  (8 children)

      rape is boring to you, got it.

      [–]svogliate 11 points12 points  (7 children)

      I would not talk rape on a date.

      I would not talk rape with a plate.

      I do not like green eggs and hamster.

      I do not like them. Pass an Amstel.

      [–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 0 points1 point  (0 children)

      Would you rape in a cape or behind the drapes?

      Would you tape a rape with an ape?

      [–]1sailorJery -1 points0 points  (5 children)

      weak rhyme but a for effort, I get what you're saying, but it's amusing that this conversation is something you would just never engage in. Maybe even among close guy friends when they bring it up?

      [–][deleted]  (1 child)

      [deleted]

        [–]1sailorJery 0 points1 point  (0 children)

        Well my close friends would. So that's why I found it interesting.

        [–]1Mikesapien 2 points3 points  (10 children)

        What the fuck is "attempted rape?"

        Either it happens, or it doesn't.

        [–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (0 children)

        Frex, War Machine getting whiskey dick.

        [–]Endorsed ContributorRedBigMan -1 points0 points  (0 children)

        It's when you pull your dick out while trying to hold her down and she kicks you in the junk and gets away from the rape train! /s

        [–][deleted]  (7 children)

        [deleted]

          [–]1Mikesapien 0 points1 point  (6 children)

          Which makes it an assault statistic of some sort, not a rape statistic. Lumping "attempted rape" with rape is like saying dropouts and graduates are both graduates.

          [–][deleted]  (5 children)

          [deleted]

            [–]1Mikesapien 0 points1 point  (4 children)

            The Koss study lumps rape and "attempted rape" together to yield the fallacious "one in four" statistic, which is absurd.

            The combined figure for rape and attempted rape of women since age 14, 27.5 percent, became known as the "one in four" statistic.

            I'm taking issue with Koss, not OP.

            [–][deleted]  (3 children)

            [deleted]

              [–]1Mikesapien 0 points1 point  (2 children)

              The Koss study asks about "attempted rape" in order to inflate the statistics. It's a total stretch.

              "Attempted rape" exists in the way that bankruptcy is "attempted wealth" - that is, an unsuccessful "attempt" is strictly the opposite of the real thing.

              When I said, "Either it [rape] happens, or it doesn't," attempted rape clearly falls under "doesn't."

              [–][deleted]  (1 child)

              [deleted]

                [–]1Mikesapien 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                Attempted murder is not murder.

                A field goal attempt is not a field goal.

                An assassination attempt is not an assassination.


                Each case, like rape, has a clear success or failure, but the Koss study tries to include failures (attempted rapes) with successes (rapes).

                This ain't rocket surgery.

                [–]jmg83 2 points3 points  (2 children)

                It depends how you define "rape". I bet they're counting drunk sex.

                [–]16 Endorsed ContributorTRPsubmitter[S] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

                I bet they're counting drunk sex.

                You don't have to bet. It literally says that in the study.

                When directly asked about rape, they women said no.

                So the researchers asked instead if they were drunk and counted that as rape.

                [–]jmg83 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                Ah. I didn't actually read the contents of the link. I should have.

                [–]EvrythingISayIsRight 4 points5 points  (1 child)

                More like 1 in 5 women had regret sex and want to parrot their victim story to every man they meet to garner sympathy.

                [–]anonlymouse 7 points8 points  (0 children)

                Not even that. Sure, they had sex they regret, but they didn't go around talking about it, they just answered a survey. A good chunk of them likely didn't realise that answering that yes they've had sex they regret would get tallied as them having been raped.

                [–]Doomblaze 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                https://time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/

                This article was a good read. It included why the 1/5 rape argument is bullshit along with other ones everyone tries to cite. Takes a few clicks but you can get to the actual data and see why its flawed too.

                [–]1IVIaskerade 1 point2 points  (9 children)

                You're trying to Logic white knights and feminists. Why?

                [–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (8 children)

                Because it actually does work some of the time. You won't get anyone fully agreeing with you in public, they'll either just stop talking or they'll go with some face saving response. Still, they do change and stop parroting that particular statistic, and really as long as they do that it doesn't matter if they admit to anyone else they were wrong.

                [–][deleted]  (7 children)

                [deleted]

                  [–]anonlymouse 2 points3 points  (6 children)

                  You will rarely ever convince someone with logic.

                  That's because logic isn't the art of convincing, rhetoric is. Logic is a tool used in rhetoric, not the whole of it.

                  [–][deleted]  (5 children)

                  [deleted]

                    [–]anonlymouse 0 points1 point  (4 children)

                    That's not how the argument goes. If you think it doesn't work, it's because you're bad at arguing, not because logic is useless.

                    [–][deleted]  (3 children)

                    [deleted]

                      [–]anonlymouse 0 points1 point  (2 children)

                      The point isn't to get sympathy. The point is to change their mind and get them to question their beliefs. You do that by making them angry. When you have them angry, they're invested, they won't just walk away - no matter how many times they say they're done, you just keep talking and they keep coming back. You keep going until they ask for scientific proof, and then you give it to them. Because they asked they can't just dismiss it because it makes them look bad, and because they're angry and invested, they'll actually read through the whole study trying to find a flaw in it.

                      If you're nice and polite, they'll never read it in detail.

                      The funny thing is, this is TRP, and your argument about how to convince someone is entirely blue pill. You don't convince anyone of anything by being nice to them.

                      [–][deleted]  (1 child)

                      [deleted]

                        [–]anonlymouse 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                        Quite the contrary. You on the other hand do, if you think saying that is in any way convincing.

                        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

                        [deleted]

                          [–]Mr_Andry 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          You're forgetting these figures came from college students. So cut that 80 year period down to 20.

                          [–]Aphrodite_ 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          You know, one of the things I learned here is to never argue with women. They don't use logic as much as emotions and they get way too emotional if proven wrong. If a woman told me this rape bullshit I'd just nod and say "aha, cool story".

                          [–]yeahweewee 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          you can't use logic when arguing about sexual assult/rape it has 0 use, no one will read that and just assume your a rapist(srs) i mean i imagine most guys know that 1/5 sht in bullsht(1/5 girls aren't even worth having sex with let alone risking a prison sentence)

                          [–]iAmNotVelma 0 points1 point  (0 children)

                          There is no way to determine the actual percent of women being raped (or men for that matter) because it is believed that most never report that it even occurred and in fact, most may even try to forget that it ever happened.

                          [–]100 Modbsutansalt -1 points0 points  (1 child)

                          1.7% of women had experienced a rape and another 1.1% had experienced an attempted rape.

                          So 2.8% in total.

                          the DOJ found that there were six rapes or sexual assaults per thousand per year. Across the nation's four million female college students, that comes to about one victim in forty students

                          So 4% in total. This doesn't seem impossible given the drinking and hooking up going on at campus bars & parties these days. Alcohol is likely the #1 contributing factor of why the rates are higher for college women.

                          All this being said, I wonder what the incident rates are for men? If I had to guess, probably equal if not higher.

                          [–]anonlymouse 1 point2 points  (0 children)

                          For 'forced to penetrate', the 2010 and 2011 CDC results were slightly lower in number, and slightly higher per capita. In both years, 80% were committed by women, which means women raping men is still slightly lower than men raping women, but only at adult ages.

                          [–]Latsbrother -4 points-3 points  (4 children)

                          The number of women raped is still too high. This is coming from a redpiller. Too many sad cunts will do absolutely anything to extract sex out of a completely drunk or vulnerable girl. I have seen it many times.

                          [–]1 Endorsed Contributorvandaalen 3 points4 points  (1 child)

                          I'd say the number of wymin getting pissed until they pass out is still too high.

                          I have seen it many times.

                          So you stood and watched some dudes rape women multiple times? Nice.

                          This is coming from a redpiller.

                          Your posting history is quite impressive and proving your claim. /s

                          [–]ItsonFire911 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

                          Women are the gate and men are the key. Just because the gate is unlocked doesn't mean you may enter.

                          Also Just because you crashed your car into a tree you shouldn't be able to blame it on being drunk and be able to get away with it.

                          [–]anonlymouse 0 points1 point  (1 child)

                          Sure, in the sense that 1 is too high.

                          [–]Latsbrother -1 points0 points  (0 children)

                          Poor in the sense that door is too law.

                          [–]chakravanti93 -5 points-4 points  (0 children)

                          I'll bet you 1 in 5 women have seduced a ravishing alpha(esque) male and creamed their fuckin' panties remembering it while filling out the survey.