all 42 comments

[–]tagged4life 75 points76 points  (3 children)

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This is sidebar material (mods?)

[–]MrOhShit 13 points14 points  (0 children)

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I agree. This is what people need to read even before they go into the articles and stuff.

Good stuff Guurzak

[–]5 Endorsed Contributorgekkozorz 23 points24 points  (1 child)

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I agree. This is a good summary of our basic philosophy.

[–]HowieGaming 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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More like basic pillosophy, amiright?

[–][deleted]  (4 children)

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[deleted]

    [–]Endorsed Contributordeepthrill 23 points24 points  (3 children)

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    TRP also seems to be a response to society telling men how they should live their lives. It's an empowering idea to not have to follow the traditional feminized western roles.

    So even if a certain behavior did not necessarily lead to more sex, but simply led a man to lead a freer, more fulfilled life, not subject to the whim of society's expectations, do you feel like that would still fit within TRP ideals?

    [–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (1 child)

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    So even if a certain behavior did not necessarily lead to more sex, but simply led a man to lead a freer, more fulfilled life, not subject to the whim of society's expectations, do you feel like that would still fit within TRP ideals?

    Absolutely. As long as you are consciously self-directed, using means which are realistically oriented towards the ends you have chosen, that's red. Most men like sex, and sex is where men are most grievously misled, so that's where we usually focus- but the same practical, intellectually honest mindset can be applied to any challenge.

    [–]hehcool 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    I agree with you, but the sidebar says "Discussion of sexual strategy". So, considering that it's one of the first things people will read in this sub, should we change that?

    I feel that people often think that the subscribers to The Red Pill only think about sex, which is not true (I think), and leads to the thought that we are just bitter because we don't get laid. Or maybe it was, but it has clearly changed, based on the discussions that I follow here (I'm kinda new here).

    [–]Offensive_Brute 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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    No quicker way to find a woman than to display your satisfaction and happiness in life without a woman. They'll charge in like a barbarian horde at the prospect of ruining your happiness.

    [–]Ethan47 13 points14 points  (2 children)

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    We encourage man to cultivate traditional masculine values, attributes, and behaviors such as physical strength, financial achievement, and confident leadership, because those traits are valuable in themselves.

    The Red Pill, as you point out here, is not JUST sexual strategy/truth. It's much more over-arching than that, it's a way to frame your life.

    [–]mrsmithwenttotown 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    I was going to post the same thing- that TRP is not JUST about sexual strategies and how to meet with success in the modern dating game, but an all-encompassing belief to rock the status quo of female-male relationships. This space also is interested in Mens Rights, the over-correcting of Feminism, and how to become a better man in general...

    To just state as your post does, 3 tenants to improve your sexual strategy and get laid, is missing out on a large part of TRP, and women/men who see this will take the wrong idea from it.

    [–]Offensive_Brute -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

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    Its the kinda stuff men learned from their fthers before feminism cut daddys balls off.

    [–]redpill85 21 points22 points  (2 children)

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    The reality is that women are the selective gender and they select for traits that will propagate our species.

    If women from the past chose mates who were emotionally needy, weak, and "beta," we would have been replaced with a different species. The strongest survive, and so women developed attraction mechanisms to properly identify genetic material (from men) to pass to the next generation .

    Society may think we don't need those same traits right now, but time and time again they are mistaken. History has taught us that the strongest and most ruthless survive, while the nice guy is lost in history.

    [–]through_a_ways 3 points4 points  (1 child)

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    If women from the past chose mates who were emotionally needy, weak, and "beta," we would have been replaced with a different species.

    I take issue with this, mainly because the last several thousand years of history were largely monogamous, with polygamy being frowned upon (for the most part)

    Most anthropologists think that the shift toward neolithic living also brought about a shift toward monogamy, over polygamy.

    It seems to me that monogamy would allow more males to unlock their productive potential.

    [–][deleted] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

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    This is excellent and much-needed. I've attempted to make the three points briefer in case they need to be used in a graphic:

    1) Men and women employ different sexual strategies.

    2) The social behaviors men are taught in Western society do not to reliably lead to sexual success.

    3) The question of which male behaviors do reliably lead to sexual success is an empirical question.

    TRP seeks to answer this question.

    [–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

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    Guurzak, just want to say RES tells me I give you a lot of upvotes.

    [–]NillaThunda 5 points6 points  (7 children)

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    I too have been trying to understand and this is my take: The Red Pill and the road that Reddit took The Red Pill are two different things.

    [–]WingedBalmung 2 points3 points  (6 children)

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    can you elaborate on this? What can I read that explains the difference?

    [–]NillaThunda 13 points14 points  (5 children)

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    Read all of the information here. TRP is about seeing the truth. It is about seeing through all the bullshit of the world. This subreddit tends to just think that TRP is about getting over on females and being a bachelor forever.

    I cannot explain everything but the basic idea is that you have to understand that you are who you are. If you are a 6 you will not get a 10 and you will never be a CEO. If you put the work into yourself, work on your physique, wardrobe, things like that, you can rise beyond what you were born with.

    Plus there are all these bullshit games that people play, especially girls. Girls play with your heart strings to better themselves. They think that they are supposed to be treated like princesses. What they do not realize is that a princess is only born to a king. So TRP is a movement to get back to the society where those are the rules. The society where Man rules, not where man bends at the knee and gives all the power to women. This is not to say that man is better than woman, it is saying that man will not be lower than woman, which unfortunately is the way things seem to be going.

    This is where all the beta talk and white knight talk come into play. Men these days are getting on all fours and crawling after women. They treat them like royalty and put them above themselves. This cuts our balls off. This makes girls expect to be showered with gifts. This is what TRP is trying to fix.

    Sorry I went on for so long. Hopefully this helps. I am open to continue this convo if you are interested, but I tend to get downvoted a lot around here, so it seems others do not agree with my take on this subject.

    [–]Ratatater 4 points5 points  (1 child)

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    The thought occurred to me that Disney has promoted a lot of princess & white knight archetypes. Might be interesting to see how these have changed our norms over time. Disney as a cultural phenomenon is pretty pervasive.

    [–]NillaThunda 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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    Absolutely. Young girls growing up as princesses and feeling they deserve to be such, could have changed our norms tremendously. Before Disney, it was always the damsel in distress being saved by the strong man.

    [–]WingedBalmung 2 points3 points  (2 children)

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    I meant elaborating on the difference between "The Red Pill" and the "road reddit took the red pill"

    [–]NillaThunda 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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    I thought I did. TRP is about seeing the truth. Reddit took TRP and made it almost primarily about sexual interactions and gaming females.

    [–]Fred_Flintstone -1 points0 points  (0 children)

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    the truth about women and men is just the tip of the iceberg my friend.

    the dark enlightenment is another name for the manosphere, and if you google that you tend to find higher quality stuff, rather than just PUA 2.0.

    http://freenortherner.wordpress.com/2013/05/17/dark-enlightenment-reading-list/

    [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

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    I agree with this post as far as helping to define some basic range of what shows up in this sub, and the domain from which is it relevant. Aside from cleaning up some of the that/which's and confusing are/to be's, this could go directly in the sidebar as a quick initial read for the uninitiated.

    [–]Swifthand 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    The 3 points could even go into the actual SR description

    [–]rickaboy 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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    I feel as though TRP also exposes popular-held views in modern culture which are designed to benefit the woman, at the expense of the man. Eg. Call for Equal rights when it benefits her, call for chivalry when it doesn't.

    [–]FG_SF 0 points1 point  (4 children)

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    "Normative" in what sense? Seeing it put as "versus" empirical is a little strange, to me.

    [–]slippery_people 12 points13 points  (2 children)

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    I think normative in the sense of how society says men/women ought to behave. We aren't worried about "right or wrong" but "true or false."

    [–]mrsmithwenttotown 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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    True or false, needs to be backed up by scientific studies or articles in a journal. Many posts in TRP are backed up with some credible or semi-credible sources, some aren't. There is nothing wrong with saying something is "normative" if that is backed up by concrete, credible scientific sources. We can't separate the meanings of "true/false" from "normative" quite yet

    [–]AlbinoCrocodile 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    Just look at guys who get girls and guys who don't. Then compare how they act. It's a really basic scientific method that's used.

    [–]greedo_posted_first 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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    Normative as opposed to positive.

    [–]dub121686 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    This should be on the sidebar. Its really a good analysis of what this is all about

    [–]Nitzi 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    Society tells you how to behave to get a relationship, this society is the matrix. To understand that everything that has been taught to you is bullshit you have to take the red pill. Or stay in the matrix and take the blue pill

    [–]Offensive_Brute -1 points0 points  (0 children)

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    I think the only thing I would change is that i'd used the word empiricism and its derivatives a few more times to really drive that point home.

    [–]mrbananahead -1 points0 points  (0 children)

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    If I had seen this post when I first started, i wouldn't have to go through all the pain to figure this by myself