all 71 comments

[–]FinnianWhitefir 87 points88 points  (4 children)

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Patrice put it really well. All during The Black Phillip Show he was explaining "We're not together. I'm with her. She's with me. Either of us could decide tomorrow to change that."

[–]sway_usa 64 points65 points  (0 children)

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Favorite quote on this subject from him:

"My girl has been with me 3 years, I've been with her for 6 months."

[–]ben_panced 37 points38 points  (0 children)

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That guy died way too soon.

[–]1100110011001 11 points12 points  (1 child)

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"If she wanted a train, I guess I'd have to give her a train... but not with you, Dante!"

[–]1Modified_Hackware 11 points12 points  (0 children)

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Don't you look at my woman like that Dante - Nigga no! YOU LOOK OUT THE WINDOW.

[–]6Invalidity 34 points35 points  (10 children)

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If you treat girls with a higher SMV with more privileges than you would a lower SMV girl, you're not exactly letting her know that you are above her.

I agree with another thing though: the sex is better with a higher SMV girl. My performance will not be better just because it is her, but because I am more attracted to her.

[–]meonta[S] 7 points8 points  (4 children)

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I know where I stand when it comes to dating. There comes SMV, from behavior and social status, and then there is SMV from looks. I am a far more introverted guy, plus I am Indian. If I am with an attractive White girl, I know I am reaching simple as that. And she isn't going to stay for very long if the only dates involve her chilling in my apartment.

My performance is better with more attractive girls too, and plus I want to show her off as well.

[–]6Invalidity 11 points12 points  (3 children)

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You're beating yourself down already. It seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy.

If you don't have any desire to improve yourself and are content with where you're at, then you are fully justified to believe what you wish to believe.

[–]meonta[S] -3 points-2 points  (2 children)

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Nowhere in my post did I say I have no desire to improve. I have a loyal group of friends, however when it comes to partying and other activities I simply can't be bothered. I am focusing on getting certifications + my degree so that way I'll have a great job. I am working on lifting and fitness. I know as I get older things like my job will translate into higher SMV. But right now in order to keep a hot girl, just fucking them isn't enough.

[–]2jagrmeister721 18 points19 points  (0 children)

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Your job won't translate into higher SMV. Please re-read this sub. You WILL become qualified as a beta male provider - and attract post-wall female washups who want to get wifed up. Totally different thing. Building attraction is a totally different set of skills that you need to build to parallel career achievement.

[–]6Invalidity 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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Keeping them as a girlfriend or spinning them like a plate?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children)

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This comment doesn't make sense because the privileges he gives the girl with higher smv isn't putting her on a pedestal. Also the higher smv girl would not necessarily know how he treats lower smv girls so she has nothing to compare it to so therefore she might still end up feeling like he is above her even though he allows her a bit more wiggle room i.e not kicking her out of bed after the act, performing for her, taking selfies etc.

[–]6Invalidity 5 points6 points  (2 children)

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I agree, he isn't necessarily putting the higher SMV girl on the pedestal but... if you notice, he's really putting himself down. "Oh, I can't keep this girl because her SMV is high, she's a hot white girl, can't keep her long." etc.

If I had to say it, it is essentially the act of pedestalling her. Overall, he has the wrong mindset. He believes that in pursuing a high paying job, he'll be able to keep these girls. But because he isn't there yet, he believes he is simply not attractive enough to keep them. That's a very erroneous mindset.

He considers the value in having a high paying job good enough to keep a girl. He's not wrong, but he has a beta's mindset. He's trying to fulfill a provider's role while ignoring everything else that goes into attraction.

[–]analredemption12 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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Agreed. I like getting girls to orgasm regardless of looks. I also don't bother with girls I don't find attractive. Sounds like op seeks validation from uglier chicks when he can't get a "hot white girl". It's a stepping stone to being RP but getting rid of the need for validation sex is important.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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Oh I must have missed that part. Yes what you say is correct. He must correct his way of thinking to get out of his own way. He needs a clear distinction between dating girls and spinning them as plates.

[–]Tqbfjotlds 36 points37 points  (3 children)

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This is why men should not get married.

Marriage is a legal document where a man legally commits his resources to his wife and she commits nothing in return. There is literally nothing that men can legally hold their wives to in a marriage anymore.

[–]user_none 8 points9 points  (0 children)

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At one time it was the child birthing and rearing that women committed. Now, with the divorce laws we have men get stripped of that quite often. So, yeah, marriage is losing situation for men.

[–]Richguy14u 7 points8 points  (0 children)

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you hit the bulls eye. Marriage is not a solution anymore, at least for the men.

[–]spoon_fucker 44 points45 points  (12 children)

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And even if you do negotiate with her for sex, you get duty sex. And anyone who has had "duty sex" or "pity sex" knows it is a soul sucking activity for both parties. Sex isn't just about having an orgasm it's about feeling desired by a woman.

Excellent point at the end here, and recently evidenced by the "sex spreadsheet" making its rounds on the internet. I think it goes something like this:

  1. Husband begs for sex
  2. Wife feels desired, husband does not.
  3. Husband begs more, wife gives in.
  4. Husband is still not satisfied, despite having sex, after realizing the wife didn't desire it at all. Wife is satisfied, and falsely believes that husband is satisfied as well.
  5. Vicious cycle continues. Husband's self-esteem goes to the shitter. Wife is hoisted on a pussy-pedestal of colossal proportions. Wife is unaware that her duty sex achieves nothing but still pats herself on the back for her minimal effort.

Problem here is the man thinks more sex will cure it. But duty sex is NEVER satisfying and NEVER worth it. The only solution as an RP man is to have some self-respect and turn down all forms of duty or pity sex.

EDIT: When I say the wife is "satisfied," I'm talking about beta validation, not true alpha sexual satisfaction. That depressing realization will come slow for her.

[–]buffmoot 6 points7 points  (0 children)

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This. I have sex almost every day and still don't feel satisfied. Being alpha, always initiating and succeeding isn't all it's cracked up to be.

To have your brains fucked out because you are truly desired by your woman, that is where satisfaction is.

Is that even possible in a marriage? Frequently? Consistently? Even MMSL doesn't seem to think so. Alluding to types of sex including meh, maintenance sex etc.

[–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 6 points7 points  (0 children)

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It can be fun getting a chick to fuck you because she owes you something. Not the easiest thing to pull off, but having her come over, get on her knees and do what you tell her can give you some sadistic pleasure. She has to really want that thing, and you have to have complete, or nearly so, control over it. You can't give her anything for free.

Yes I can be a twisted bastard when I want to be. Some of them really enjoy feeling dirty and used like that.

[–]phil619 3 points4 points  (9 children)

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Is sex with a prostitute duty sex? Even if you are fit and she seemed to enjoy it?

[–]Bobbagwell 11 points12 points  (2 children)

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It's only doody sex if there is anal. That is my rule.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

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[deleted]

    [–]1BadgerBurger 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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    It would almost seem as though a business would like to see customers repeat frequently...

    [–]meonta[S] 6 points7 points  (1 child)

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    I haven't slept with any prostitutes so keep that in mind.

    It's in the grey zone really, prostitutes are masters at acting. No high class escort just bends over and tells the guy to hurry up while she watches Rachel Ray. However, if you were to bang a hot girl without paying her, you'd be far more happy.

    [–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 10 points11 points  (0 children)

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    Pussy is pussy, doesn't matter if you pay up front or you pay later in some way. It shouldn't be what makes you happy, but it is somewhat more of an ego boost and gives you a somewhat larger feeling of accomplishment when you get a hot chick to fuck you for free.... At least until you can do it easily and often.

    Visiting the red light in Germany is like going to the movies, except a bitch that is as hot as you want that night sucks you then fucks you. If she really likes you she will take her time getting you off and not make you pay extra. If she doesn't like you she takes her time, edges you, and makes you pay extra.

    Things we do when we are 19 during the cold war.

    [–]spoon_fucker 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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    Interesting question. I think there's less at stake and you don't have to care about the effect on the relationship. It's not really something I'd care for but I think it can be healthier than begging for sex if you aren't paying more than you can afford.

    [–]1FloranHunter 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    Just conjecture but I doubt it's as soul-sucking since a whore is someone you don't love and whom never loved you.

    [–]drallcom3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    For some it is. Others can fake it well or even enjoy it.

    [–]Weaponbychoice 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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    History: Ex had duty sex with me. Was seeing a lava hot escort at the time.

    For the escort, Yes it is duty sex, yes they enjoy it, yes there's real emotions flying around.

    The 'duty' is what gets things started, but *can soon move into real fun territory.

    My ex enjoyed duty sex too, by enjoyed I mean multiple raging orgasms and squirting. Pretty standard tail end of an LTR.

    A beta providing enjoyable mind blowing sex is not uncommon; although I could clearly tell she dreaded knowing she was going to have sex with beta me.

    Mind blowing sex does not help attraction (the part that gets you to the sex).

    [–]tastysquid 24 points25 points  (3 children)

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    To women, men are purveyors of fun and support whose job it is to make these things appear out of thin air.

    I was on a plane sitting next to a guy and girl. The guy was using a crutch because he had injured his ankle. I wasn't in the mood for conversation so ignored them both. They seemed to hit it off well, but the girl mentioned her bf within the first 5 minutes of their conversation. Undeterred the guy continued on, asking about her job, house, etc.

    They had a fairly steady conversation over the 2.5 hours the flight lasted, with the woman at some points doubled over with laughter. I thought he was making fair progress and as we landed I silently hoped he would close with at least a number or fb details.

    He didn't and we exited the plane quickly as we were in a row near the door. On the steps down from the plane (Ryanair) the guy struggled to descend because of his crutch. The girl was alongside him and I braced myself for a long wait as she helped him down the stairs. After all, they had been in a fairly deep conversation for 2.5 hours. Instead, she clutched her bag, looked forward and moved quickly down the stairs, leaving the guy to limp down the stairs alone with his crutch. She probably had forgotten all about him by the time she reached the terminal. He had expended his usefullness, which was to entertain her during the flight. I felt bad for the guy, but something had put me off about both of them, so I didn't feel too bad.

    [–]elevul 4 points5 points  (2 children)

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    Christ, that's brutal. Did you help him down?

    [–]tastysquid 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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    I have to admit I didn't. Had I made some sort of connection with him I would have but I didn't particularly like him or his views from the conversation I heard.

    [–][deleted]  (2 children)

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    [deleted]

      [–]NotReallyEthicalLOL 3 points4 points  (1 child)

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      what if promotions and women isn't what life is about?

      [–]vzhu 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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      That's for you to decide. Value is given to where it's found.

      [–]tastysquid 4 points5 points  (5 children)

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      I tried the "demonstrating higher value" stuff with my gf and it didn't work for me. I guess I'm not that good an actor. But 2 years later something interesting happened. I got a better job, started seeing other girls, started nofap, hitting the gym more. She can somehow sense it and is a lot more submissive and less argumentative and the sex is way better.

      [–]korewarp 1 point2 points  (4 children)

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      I've seen this nofap thing so many times now. Does it really matter that much? (I fap at least once a day. AT LEAST. I feel cranky & asocial if I don't get a fap in for over a day - so not fapping in my world = detrimental to my health).

      [–]16 Endorsed ContributorCyralea 5 points6 points  (2 children)

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      It's a waste of time, and it's killing your desire to actually pursue pussy. You don't necessarily need to cut it out of your life, but cut it down to maybe 1-2 times a week. If you're not having sex at all you may want to consider going cold turkey for the first little while.

      Channel that tension into actually chasing women.

      [–]korewarp 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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      I'm afraid, If I don't fap, I'll act hostile towards women instead of 'pursue' them. :/

      [–]16 Endorsed ContributorCyralea 6 points7 points  (0 children)

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      That would still work in your favour.

      [–]tastysquid 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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      Try it out and see what it does for you. I feel much more social on nofap.

      [–]Mightyskunk 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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      I take scalp massages over sex any day.

      [–]_SEEING_RED 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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      Guys. It's tenet not tenant.

      <puts down pitchfork>

      Appeasement to the Red God automoderator.

      [–]16 Endorsed ContributorCyralea 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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      No one owes you sex, but no one can deny you the right to pursue it. If your woman won't fuck you then just next her for someone who will.

      Getting married takes away this option, which is part of the reason why it's pretty fucking dumb to do it.

      [–]cooltrip 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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      Women crawl to alpha. Betas crawl to women.

      If you are a beta but you have aspirations to be better than a beta, don't crawl to women.

      Always treat women according to how they treat you. Don't let unworthy women be within your personal circle.

      Don't try to make women treat you in a certain way so you can treat them that way too. Treat women according to how they treat you, without trying to influence how women treat you.

      Always behave on the basis of the good things you have, not on the basis that there are good things you don't have.

      [–]whitey_male 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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      No. They don't owe us sex. Personally I hate having sex if I'm drunk or have been eating poorly and I'm feeling sluggish. But we can criticise them for who they do have sex with just as they do us.

      I'm not convinced that we can't change women. I mean we had them in the palms of our hands for thousands of years. Not that I want to go back to that. Just pre stage 2 feminism. In fact there have been studies that show gen y is more conservative than gen x. So it's already happening.

      I mean how much nicer were the girls in the 70s and 80s porn?

      [–]Daredfenomeno 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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      I agree with your point and everything man, but why wouldnt you let her take a selfie after you just fucked her? Am I missing something?

      [–]2jagrmeister721 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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      The short-term opportunistic mindset, taken to the extreme, misses the mark. It's one thing to say we need to keep adding value to our plate or S.O's life (stay fit, build attraction, etc.) and another thing to say that there ought to be zero loyalty between people. Everytime I read an post like this I swear some people want men to behave like women; to act like Briffault's Law applies to us as well- that there is no such thing as mutualism between people. Just like the Blue Pill mentality is extreme in that it ignores people's "what have you done for me lately" mentality which is very real, the other extreme is "people are fungible; past good deeds have no value today; life is solely transactional". In the world of spinning plates, the latter applies; in terms of life, LTR, and the broader picture, I don't believe either extreme; there's a middle ground.

      [–]1 Endorsed Contributorjsl2837 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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      Actually, women do 'owe' us sex.

      Sex is the non-negotiable part of a sexual relationship.

      It's like owing rent. She can string you along for a while, but it doesn't take very long before she gets evicted.

      Commitment, on the other hand, is completely optional. It has to be, or "Try before you buy" will have no meaning.

      One might argue that so is sex. But no. The timeframe of commitment far exceeds the timeframe of sex. A man has far more time to decide whether to commit, than a woman has time to decide whether to let a man fuck her.

      White moves first. The woman always makes the first move.

      No sex? OK. Next.

      Secondly, whether desire can or cannot be "negotiated" boils down to semantics.

      When Rollo Tomassi coined the saying, "You cannot negotiate desire," he was criticizing 'Full Disclosure'.

      http://therationalmale.com/2011/08/25/the-desire-dynamic/:

      Half of the battle is knowing you want to be with a woman who wants to please you, not one who feels obligated to. You will never draw this genuine desire from her by overt means, but you can covertly lead her to this genuine desire. The trick in provoking real desire is in keeping her ignorant of your intent to provoke it. Real desire is created by her thinking it’s something she wants, not something she has to do.

      So let's take a look at less overt forms of communication.

      http://xsplat.wordpress.com/2014/07/28/how-to-negotiate-desire-with-a-woman/:

      Women have different minds than men do, and so persuasion with women requires building years of interaction in order to build up useful theories of mind. You can’t just tell them what you want.

      But it is a negotiation.

      If you force a smile, you force an improved mood. If you put a woman into a red party dress and have her hold your elbow, you change her attitude towards you.

      It IS a negotiation.

      It’s just a set of rules that are not innately known to men.

      Women operate at an initial relationship advantage, if they are hot. A hottie virgin can tool an old man, purely out of instinct. But once you learn the language, you get the advantage. Because you can apply male intellect to the game.

      [–]realityczek 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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      A core tenant of /r/theredpill[2] is that you can’t negotiate desire.

      This. This+. This++.

      [–]TheeRyanGrey 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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      You bring women happiness and stability.

      This is why boring, emotionally fragile men turn women off so quickly. Women subconsciously seek out men who can control the turbulence of their emotional zephyrs.

      [–]BluepillProfessor 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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      No doubt airline girl was peeved that beta-cripple did not hit on her. That is always a strike to a girls ego and they despise men who don't at least make the attempt.

      [–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours 0 points1 point  (2 children)

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      If you're lonely being by yourself then you are shitty company.

      I'm not lonely at all, but I am still shitty company because I'm an anti social prick...OK well some of the time.

      [–]yunietheoracle 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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      An anti - social prick on The Red Pill? Shocking.

      [–]2 Endorsed Contributorvengefully_yours -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

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      I've been on reddit for years, learned from the best IRL which is how I became antisocial. People are sheep, you look like you need the clippers again.

      [–]evergonitenitenigga 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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      Although I agree to that statement to some degree, i have never treated sex or commitment as a commodity, its not something you give nor take. sex just happens if both sexes are attracted. A commitment develops if both sexes connects on a level other than the physical. When im with a girl, its an experience we both enjoyed that night and never from a frame of mind where i took something from her.

      [–]MasonJarTeaDrinker -3 points-2 points  (1 child)

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      Good post bro, you're totally right,