all 98 comments

[–]Xero_hax 93 points94 points  (7 children)

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Good post. Another option would be I'm going to go (insert thing) you can either stay here or come with. No more asking. Just do.

[–]dr_bloodmoney 36 points37 points  (2 children)

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I was thinking along the same lines. I make plans to do things I want to do. People can come along or not. I'm sticking to my plan.

[–]1RXRob 8 points9 points  (0 children)

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Learn to enjoy your own company and getting a negative response doesn't even matter. Some of my best days and nights out have been by myself, and my last lone gig ended with a quiet drink with a 8/10 foreigner who was also alone that night.

[–]rztzz 24 points25 points  (2 children)

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I really hate a lot of seduction stuff, but this was one of the few lasting lessons I read. The guy goes: never ask her out, always invite her to what you're already doing.

"I'm going to the mall tomorrow and could use some advice, I'll pick you up around 2".

The one caveat is that I feel "I've been meaning to try this new place" is really lame

[–]FinnianWhitefir[S] 11 points12 points  (1 child)

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Yes, because you're leaving open that it's random and not your fault if it sucks. It's the difference between "I'm randomly taking you to someplace that I foolishly hope to luck into being good" vs "I'm going somewhere that I know is going to be awesome, you're welcome to come with me".

[–]rebuildingMyself 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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Which is why I usually vet places out first with friends if at all possible

[–]spitenl 34 points35 points  (0 children)

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This could not be more true.

I went out for dinner with a girl from tinder last month. That's around when I started really reading seduction, TRP, etc so I was trying hard to put things into practice. When we were deciding where to go, I cut all bullshit and just named the restaurant I was craving instead of even asking where she wanted to go. That's exactly where we went.

Here's the real kicker: during the meal she tells me that she ate there the night before for a friend's birthday.

She literally went to the same restaurant two nights in a row because I didn't ask where she wanted to go, I just assumed the answer would be yes and told her where we were going.

[–]legedu 29 points30 points  (1 child)

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I work in sales, and this is a very hard thing to do with people that know your tactics. Also, this is very hard to do with women who get game thrown at them all of the time. In both arenas it's still effective, but you just have to step up a level.

"I know you said you were trying to eat healthier, so let's go to that new organic restaurant tonight."

Use something she has already said to enhance what you want to do. Basically make it sound like it was her idea all along, and you can have great success with assuming the sale.

Edit: had to put down a stray apostrophe

[–]decoydevo 12 points13 points  (0 children)

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ah man, poor apostrophe

[–]SillyAmerican 28 points29 points  (4 children)

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Being Assertive has immense effects on your Psyche. I try and do things as assertively as possible. Even walking! I would sometimes linger and wait for people to catch up, but i realized if I walked like I knew where I was going people would subconsciously think I was leading them and for the most part would speed up to catch up. Its a simple example but im sure it holds true to a lot of decisions in life. Great post. Upvote for you.

[–]itsmsbetty 4 points5 points  (3 children)

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I do this a lot as well. Walking assertively makes people trust that you have a plan.

But I also have problems with it. sometimes people don't catch up. They just kinda chill in the back and talk or walk slowly, and then I just feel like an idiot because I'm walking by myself, and I can either stop and linger till they catch up or keep walking and be alone.

[–]BooksofMagic 4 points5 points  (1 child)

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option 3 is walk slower while they catch up. Option 4 is you say "Hey I'm leaving you behind back there"

[–]Tfsr92 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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Dive into assertiveness, "Hey! Walk faster!" "Stay close behind me, let's move move move!"

[–]SillyAmerican 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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Haha true. Obviously variables are present like how many ppl are present and the ddynamic of the group

[–]17 Endorsed ContributorJP_Whoregan 93 points94 points  (15 children)

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To expand on this, you can also use what I like to call "A or B" philosophy when dealing with women (or children, for that matter). Example:

"So would you rather go see an action flick or a comedy movie this weekend"?

"Ummm...I dunno, a comedy I guess."

"Great. I'll see you at the theater at 7:30 on Saturday for Movie XYZ."

Before I even opened my mouth, I have already presupposed a couple of assumptions, and I've also made three decisions for her without her even realizing it:

1.) We are going on a date on Saturday.

2.) That date will be going to a movie, because that's what I want to do.

3.) We are going to see a movie from a genre that I'm interested in.

and then after the conversation, I have determined the date, the time, and I have established that she will be driving herself to the theater.

By letting her pick the genre from a selection of two or three genres, she feels like the whole damn thing was her idea and she's oh so damn smart. But in reality, she's just been mind-fucked so hard there is semen leaking out her ears.

[–][deleted]  (9 children)

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    [–][deleted]  (6 children)

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      [–][deleted]  (4 children)

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        [–][deleted]  (1 child)

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          [–]Veqq 3 points4 points  (0 children)

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          [–]Sturmgeist781 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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          Stick around for a while and read.

          Worst you could do is learn some things that you don't like.

          [–]17 Endorsed ContributorJP_Whoregan 9 points10 points  (1 child)

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          Anything I post is hereby licensed to TRP for reproduction and use.

          [–]connorcook13 10 points11 points  (0 children)

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          And use in reproduction.

          [–]IDefyAxioms 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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          I like this method quite a bit. It allows you to stay in control of the situation while creating something for you to jump off from; leading while still cultivating options given by others.

          [–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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          A same tactic is employed on little children when you want them to drink their juice. "I DONT WANT JUICE" "Ok do you want the red or green cup though?" "GREEN CUP. HMPH."

          Hurdle the shit test up front, presuppose the outcome, and proceed to the outcome.

          [–]throwaway75369 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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          This also detects the smartasses.

          There is a Russian prisoners' riddle: "You fall in a ditch and see a bull's dick and a cupcake. What will you eat and what will you stick up your ass?"

          The right answer is to get out of the ditch and eat the cupcake. Such "out of the box", "the third option" answers to a "action vs. comedy" question (even "neither") may alert a strong, independent woman.

          [–]refrigeratorbob 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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          Idk man, girls busy during the nearest weekend isn't that uncommon, and doesn't necessarily equate to either strong nor independent. Just saying this particular case wasn't a great example, although otherwise I would mostly agree... Except for that riddle. Ask 100 women and 90 will give you a third option, ie not put a bull dick or a cupcake up their ass. The other 10 might say both to both questions.

          [–]dudebro48 20 points21 points  (3 children)

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          I've been doing this for years. It drove me fuckin' crazy in high school. "Where do you wanna go?" "IDK where do you wanna go?" Three hours later everyone is hungry.

          [–]charlie_bodango 20 points21 points  (2 children)

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          [–]RejectionEquality 8 points9 points  (0 children)

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          But we've eaten there twice this week! Can't we go somewhere else?

          [–]TechnoL33T 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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          Brilliant.

          [–]itsmsbetty 35 points36 points  (9 children)

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          Because people don't know what they want 90% of the time, they don't care what they are doing 90% of the time, and they will be happy doing anything that a leader wants them to do 90% of the time.

          So true, and something i've started to really take advantage of. It makes shit so much easier. I can even use myself as an example, and you're right. I don't care where we eat, I don't care where we go, I don't care where we chill. I'm good with whatever the 'group' wants. But if everyone is like that, then the group doesn't move. There needs to be someone making that decision. And that's the roll I take on in my group of friends, and i've gotten a lot of respect from them.

          I'm not a jerk, or a douche. I'm just straight forward and honest.

          "I'm hungry, what do you guys wanna eat? Chinese? McDonalds? Tacos?"

          "Chinese, you're driving"

          "Cool"

          Which is very different from:

          "I'm hungry, what do you guys wanna eat? Chinese? McDonalds? Tacos?"

          Person 1: "don't really care, chinese?"

          Person 2: "I had tacos yesterday!"

          Person 3: "not really that hungry, but anything works"

          "kaaaaay, so McDonalds, Chinese, or Tacos?"

          [–]super-zap 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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          In such situations I like asking everyone a yes or no question and then tallying those up and deciding.

          People either agree and move on or object strongly enough and a decision is still reached.

          [–]cooledcannon 2 points3 points  (5 children)

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          I dont understand why guys(as opposed to girls) dont do this more often. Put yourself out there and state your plans/intentions. If the other kids dont like it, they will say so and then you can always change your mind later...

          [–]refrigeratorbob 6 points7 points  (1 child)

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          I usually dont care enough

          [–]cooledcannon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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          Well, doing nothing is a better alternative to what i said. But my way is better than asking questions about what you want.

          [–]Humble_harpdarp 4 points5 points  (2 children)

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          Because no one usually feels strongly about it, and it's easier to just go with the flow.

          [–]itsmsbetty 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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          yep

          [–]cooledcannon 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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          Well, doing nothing is a better alternative to what i said. But my way is better than asking questions about what you want.

          [–]drallcom3 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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          Group decisions are always a pain in the ass. You just have to make the decision for the group, maybe a place where everyone can find something, and live with the fact, that not everyone is super happy with it.

          You're the leader and you decide what's best for the group. It's a bit different from the usual TRP dogma of deciding just what you like. That only works for 2 persons.

          [–]Sturmgeist781 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

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          And that's the roll I take on in my group of friends

          Why would you steal bread?

          [–]ThirdLegGuy 16 points17 points  (1 child)

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          "Hi, Jane. I'm Paul. Nice to meet you. Today we are sleeping together. 8 PM, my place."

          [–]shadowq8 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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          "that was a snuggly nap"

          [–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (5 children)

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          It's amazing how such a subtle shift in words can have this strong impact.

          "Let's have dinner tomorrow night" is so massively more powerful than "Do you want to have dinner tomorrow night?"

          Fuck it, if you are new to this idea i'll make it simple: go ahead and say "Let's..." instead of "Do you want to..." whenever possible (or whatever appropriate variation of words, obviously). This rule applies to everyone you speak to, not just girls.

          [–]FinnianWhitefir[S] 8 points9 points  (4 children)

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          Definitely. Part of what brought this on was I realized every work email I was sending included some non-committal language. "I think we should do...", "You might want to try...", "X will hopefully fix this".

          I've banned myself from typing any <might, perhaps, I think, hopefully, maybe, should>. Sending an email that instead reads "You need to do X. If that doesn't work contact me again." comes across a lot more boss.

          [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child)

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          Yep, and to expand further - if you can have this personality in both the workplace and your interactions with others in general (friends or strangers, male or female), you'll pretty much automatically become alpha in your interactions with women... I think it would be hard for that to NOT happen.

          Too many guys focus solely on "tricks" to fake being alpha specifically in interactions with women, and don't do anything with other aspects of life (fake-it-til-you-make-it is a great starting point, but you can't use this crutch forever). I floundered unsuccessfully with PUA stuff until I finally started changing my personality and manner of interacting with people in ALL aspects of my life.

          [–]90daysandout 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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          Old post, but can you elaborate on how this has worked for you in the workplace?

          [–]90daysandout 0 points1 point  (1 child)

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          I know this is an old post, but can you give an update on how that's going for you in the workplace?

          [–]FinnianWhitefir[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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          It's great. I find when you deny someone, one of three things happens. 1. You go "I don't think we can't do this, sorry" and they go "This guy is meek and isn't sure, I can bully him into doing something". 2. You go "No" and they go "I don't have any other option, I should keep up with this guy". 3. You go "No, that isn't allowed. Talk to X and they can find a different solution." You've explained conclusively that you aren't going to do it and given them a solution, and they don't bother you again.

          We recently got a new boss and all had to present slides on ourselves. Paying attention to it, it was really surprising the extreme amounts of "I'm not an expert in anything, I'm just a general jack-of-all-trades guy, I think I'm okay at X, I have some knowledge in Y". There was a real difference between the people who confidently listed "I have 3 years experience in X, I've got these certifications in A, B, C, I run this stuff".

          While it's all generic confidence, I think lots of people don't realize the level of uncertainty and down-selling themselves that they do unconsciously.

          [–]RedPill_Rorschach 11 points12 points  (0 children)

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          You're perfectly correct OP. Once I decided to take my life into my own hands and stop wasting time trying to get approval or asking for others' opinions when I really wanted to do something, my life got exponentially better and those around me started valuing my ideas much more.

          [–]ProfessorD2 9 points10 points  (1 child)

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          If it's something I really don't care about I'll let the other person list some options and then I just pick one. Since they listed it as an option they can't very well bitch about what I end up picking.

          Me: "Pick three places you wouldn't mind eating at tonight."

          Wife: "Olive Garden, Chinese down the road, or that new steak house that just opened."

          Me: "Steak and blowjob night it is."

          [–]FinnianWhitefir[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

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          Hah, a couple weeks ago I was driving with the parents, who I always have the issue with. I went: Me: Mom, name three possible places we could eat at. Mom: Mexican place, burger place, chinese place. Me: Dad, cross off one of those places. Dad: We just had a burger, let's not go there. Me: Between chinese and mexican, I choose the mexican place.

          Really worked out well, given that if I asked either of them to pick one place to eat at, they wouldn't name one.

          [–]monsieurhire2 40 points41 points  (8 children)

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          I twice made the mistake of asking a girl on the phone where they wanted to eat dinner. I didn't care and was curious to see what they came up with. You could tell by the change in their voice that they were, at the least, non-plussed by my behavior. And here I thought women wanted you to solicit their opinions.

          Nope, just wanted to be dictated to.

          [–]SabineLavine 23 points24 points  (4 children)

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          In my single days, it was one of my biggest pet peeves for a guy to ask me out and expect me to decide where to eat, which movie to see, etc. It puts the woman in an uncomfortable position, and makes the man seem indecisive, which is a big turnoff.

          [–]monsieurhire2 10 points11 points  (2 children)

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          Lol, actually now that I recall, I suggested some places, and then asked for their input. Their tone got a bit icy, but then I smoothed things over by taking the lead again.

          Here's the thing, if I can't rely on a woman to pick a restaurant now and then, how can I trust her to raise my fucking children? She'll be calling me every five seconds saying, "Billy did this! Susie did that! What should I do?"

          What was funny about their reaction was how they communicated a judgment of my character purely based on me asking for their opinion on something completely trivial, like a restaurant! Don't they know of any good restaurants? It wasn't like I was asking them for guidance on how to live my life.

          [–]Hoodwink 4 points5 points  (0 children)

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          It wasn't like I was asking them for guidance on how to live my life.

          Maybe. Just maybe. That's exactly what they are screening for? How you live your life.

          That makes a lot of sense, right? Suddenly, being a jerk/bad-boy makes sense from a primal point-of-view. You (she) gets the resources.

          [–]16 Endorsed ContributorCyralea 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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          Perfect example of how being a leader benefits both parties.

          [–]17 Endorsed ContributorJP_Whoregan 31 points32 points  (0 children)

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          EGG-FUCKING-ZACTLY. Even when I was being a beta faggot in my last relationship, that was the one thing I was always "Alpha" on, and it's funny now that I reflect on it, those were the times she was most submissive and obedient. I'd come home from work and say,

          Me: "We have tickets to the hockey game on Friday. Make sure your calendar is clear."

          Ex: "Well, I was supposed to go out with Jody Blowmydick and rub chemical pastes and waxes all over my fingernails on Friday night..."

          Me: "Well, the tickets are already purchased. If you don't wanna come to the game, I'll find somebody who does want to go."

          She never missed a game.

          [–]Xein 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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          Women have trouble with those kind of decisions anyway, it makes them uncomfortable. That feeling of discomfort and anxiety becomes YOUR fault. Which is why they get pissy with you.

          Even with a consistent plate or LTR this applies. Just keep making the plans, if they really, really don't like it, they will tell you. Though, you can majorly impress them if you start to pick up on what kinds of food they crave and the little hints they drop. Then when you take them exactly where they want without even asking it seems like you just fucking magically know what she 'needs'.

          [–]monsieurhire2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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          Notice how by doing this, I'm essentially acting as their unpaid social director. It's one thing if I want to do something and bring them along, it's another if I'm trying to anticipate their needs and cater to them. That's hard work, and it also requires me to compromise.

          If a woman can't decide on a restaurant, she's a moron.

          I guess the answer for me from now on is just pick the restaurant I want to go to and they can tag along.

          [–]cyber_rigger 9 points10 points  (0 children)

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          People are to lazy to make create a decision.

          It requires the effort of thinking.

          [–]slomotionhighscore 7 points8 points  (1 child)

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          This is genuinely brilliant, thank you. This is the type of post that breaks through all of the so-so-info and uses a few words to plant an idea in ones mind that sticks. I think your suggestion is 90% true.

          I mentioned TRP on r/relationships yesterday to some guy who was suffering from a scarcity mindset over some girl who wasn't attracted to his neediness ( who would be? )

          I find most of what's on here to be engaging and helpful like your post but the rest of reddit jumped on my suggestion with a ferocity of downvotes that only made me smirk with disbelief.

          Anything that gets someone to fly off the handle like a couple of redditors did to me for even suggesting OP check out TRP means that there is some serious truth bubbling up in here.

          This is the type of post I usually think of when I am reminded of this subreddit.

          Thanks again - crystal clear knowledge.

          Incorporating as soon as I wake up and begin to use the logic on myself.

          [–]FinnianWhitefir[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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          It's a tough place. I know if I had run across this three years ago I would have been horrified and wouldn't have read past the headlines. I got sucked into that "Everyone needs to know about this, it all makes sense and I enjoy knowing the truth!" but it didn't take long to realize that you can't even show it to most people.

          I joke that all we want from them is something that makes sense and works better, and we'll all leave TRP in a second for that. Given that it only brings "Be yourself", "It'll happen eventually", and "Be nice to girls", we need this place.

          [–]stuckey3 6 points7 points  (2 children)

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          absolutely

          When I meet a girl for the first time, after getting her number, I just say something like "We're having dinner next week so wear something pretty. I like skirts and heels."

          [–]erich_von_stalhein 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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          What, heels all week in case tonight's the night?

          [–]stuckey3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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          lel

          ok u can wear boots too then, not too high tho

          [–][deleted]  (2 children)

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          [deleted]

            [–]throwwhatthere 4 points5 points  (1 child)

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            Is is Feminazi scum, or feminazi's cum? I've got to know!

            P.S. Had this shit during the summer too. One day I snapped, told her we were going that day. Two hours later she's packed her shit, booked a room, and we're in the car. Too bad she was a colossal bitch the whole time.

            [–]varisforge 7 points8 points  (0 children)

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            The marines call this, "Leading by negation." Basically, you state that you are doing something, and if no one says "don't do that" then you do it.

            It is a great leadership skill and perfect for systems where there are too many steps to the nearest commander, such as the mind of a non-assertive woman.

            [–]mydarkmeatrises 7 points8 points  (0 children)

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            This might be the most helpful thing I've ever read on Reddit.

            [–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children)

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            I'm going to get shit on for this but don't do this 100% of the time.

            If you are meeting a person for the first time or in a fresh relationship don't do this all the time, do it frequently to establish a frame of dominance/leadership but don't go out of your way to decide shit for people; allowing others to remain autonomous is a sign of good leadership as well. Doing this makes people learn what you want and there is an implicit trust because they can predict your responses to certain things. if you are in a pack of male peers this leadership role should fluctuate and float freely without active conflict or passive aggression there isn't a real flow chart for who deserves it or who it should be but if it's just guys the most alpha males will trade off in a sort of orbit and you have to learn the ropes with that because if one of them breaks ranks and throws a tantrum it makes him look bad to the entire group. If there are women imbedded in this peer pack a friend would cede some of his authority to whomever has dibs on any specific female unless it's a free for all situation, This is to improve your comrades chances with that female, whatever his purposes may be LTR, plate or just whore hoppin'. Basically a good leader knows when to take an assisting roll when it benefits the group. this does not apply if said peer cannot stand up to your authority on his own, essentially don't pass up power to a beta they don't know how to handle it.

            The more controversial tip is that if you meet a chick you want for an LTR and this works every time be aware of how much less trustworthy she is for it. She has no inherent dignity if this works 100% of the time. If you believe there are a few outliers in women look for the ones that have established morals and try to cross those lines, don't get arrested for sexual assault and don't be relentless in this pursuit, basically your just pushing her boundaries to make sure they are real. You can expect any woman with real boundaries to be more faithful but don't throw out redpill if she breaks it off because you pushed too hard; explain your intentions, the reasoning behind them and ask for another go. This is tricky because the only way to find one of these girls is to make them hate you. Do your best to side step anything that would break frame like apologizing directly to her, see if you can get back in through one of her friends otherwise get creative.

            [–][deleted]  (3 children)

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            [deleted]

              [–]17 Endorsed ContributorJP_Whoregan 17 points18 points  (2 children)

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              It's the same way with children, really. See, good parents never say to their young children, "Hey! Whattaya wanna DO on Saturday?!?!" Because you're gonna get 100 different fucking answers that have no basis in reality or financial reason. They'll say, "let's go to Disney!" "I wanna go for ice cream!" "I wanna go to the mall!", etc, etc....the answers would be endless.

              So instead, you say to kids, "Would you rather go to the beach and swim or would you rather go to the park and play on the jungle gym?" You give them boundaries while also giving them the illusion that they are making the decision. Same applies to grown ass women.

              [–]Prometheus720 10 points11 points  (1 child)

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              I'd like to point out that this isn't just women, it's just immature people in general. Women may tend to do this more but there are tons of people who do this IN EVERY ARENA OF THEIR LIFE. And that has implications outside of TRP. Big ones.

              [–]verus_mas 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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              Yeah this strategy is used in business/salary negotiations as well.

              [–]mbr902000 5 points6 points  (0 children)

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              One of my plates has a girlfriend that is on the edge of divorce. One of the main reasons is because the guy can never take control of the situation and make a decision or be a leader. She was fucking fuming on Valentines Day because she ended up deciding what they were gonna do. This whole topic is absolute truth..

              [–]Tidbitter 5 points6 points  (6 children)

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              I started doing exactly this about 2 years ago (after the third love of my life broke my heart - I'll address that at another time).

              It truly is game changer. It works in the professional world also.

              I'm an older man. I should have been doing that decades ago.

              You young whipper snappers should listen to OP.

              [–]FinnianWhitefir[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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              Me too. I didn't realize something was wrong until 36, and it's been a few years until I'm at this point. Still got a long ways to go until my life is where I'd like it to be, but I'm taking way better care of myself and am much happier in life. It leaves me slightly jealous of the guys showing up here at 21, but you've got to take that journey to get here, and I wouldn't go back to living like that for anything.

              [–]90daysandout 0 points1 point  (4 children)

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              I know this is an old post, but can you elaborate on how this worked for you in the professional world?

              [–]Tidbitter 1 point2 points  (3 children)

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              No prob. I work as part of a team in a project-related line of work (oil and gas). The overall budget is usually apps $200MM.There is a generalized objective of what needs to be done, but certainly no specific details on how to get all the tasks done. There are many decisions that need to be made. When there are so many people involved in the project, the number of optional methods and objectives increases accordingly. It's best if one of the team members steps forward and takes the lead by clearly establishing the requirements, assigning responsibilities, establishing a budget and deadlines, etc. I don't claim to know all the aspects of each discipline (and I make that clear that the group is counting on one of the teammates) but I gladly take the lead and get everyone's buy-in on the plan. If no one took the lead in doing this, the entire project would most likely fail and each individual would be blamed. In my business, I'm only as good as my last project. Since my wellbeing at stake - it's in my best interest to ensure that the project is a success by taking the lead.

              Previously, I would only ride along on the dysfunctional team's train and silently wish there was a better conductor at the helm.

              I hope that satisfactorily fulfilled your request.

              [–]90daysandout 0 points1 point  (2 children)

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              That's great - thank you for for taking the time to reply.

              What are your thoughts on telling people to do things vs asking them, in the context of management? This thread is called "never ask a question always assume yes", which seems to work well with women, but does it translate well in a team setting? You mentioned you took the helm for your projects, but specifically what kind of language did you use? For instance if you wanted a team-member to do something, is in better to say "John I need you to do X"; or "John would you be able to do X?".

              [–]Tidbitter 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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              In my experience, the team usually consists of a mix of both strong and weak members (typical anywhere, really). The weaker members tend need specific instructions, otherwise, they'll get little done. They also need praise (that's another chapter). The stronger ones will usually respond to allowing them to have a say in how they want to accomplish the objective.

              Example: Once, I was sent to a rig where 12 men were just sitting around waiting for their supervisor (who reported to me) to instruct them on what to do. The supervisor generally had the "can't-do" attitude. Always finding a reason why he couldn't accomplish a job ("this pole is in the way", specifically on this job). I only knew the objective and wasn't sure how to proceed, so I toldhim, "Yeah, that sounds difficult and unsafe", then asked him, "What do YOU think the best way (to accomplish the task) is? He gladly told me the way he thought was by god the" right" way to proceed and anybody who thought differently was an idiot. I simply said, "That sounds like a clever plan. Go ahead with that plan and let me know how I can help you achieve it." In a matter of minutes, all those guys (who were the type who needed specific directions), and the supervisor (who wanted to have a say in how to achieve the goal) were back to work and the job was done by the end of the day.

              Tl:dr Each individual responds to different methods of instructions.

              I don't mean to come off like a superstar, or all-knowing. I just recognize (over years of observation) that individuals need to be motivated differently. If they don't have a leader who knows how to optimize their worth, the job is at a high-risk of being unsuccessful.

              [–]90daysandout 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              Solid advice. Indeed as with many things, it's on a case-by-case basis. Thanks again for taking the time to respond, much appreciated!

              [–]throwaway75369 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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              Maybe they also have no damn clue whose mug that was. Being direct helps even more in such scenario.

              [–]6TLaRm4g 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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              I live by the rule assume (or hope) for the best, but be prepared for the worst.

              [–]1bradyo2 2 points3 points  (0 children)

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              This is sound advice. I was in a foul mood when I went to see my friends at the weekend, all because they ignored me when I asked if they wanted tickets for the football at the weekend on our whatsapp group. Granted, they shouldn't have ignored me (especially as they agreed to it the weekend before), but I gave them the perfect opportunity to shirk from their responsibility. I should have called directly and said "How many tickets am I getting for Sunday". Simple.

              [–]Tway_the_Parley 6 points7 points  (0 children)

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              My dad is like that and it drives my mom crazy. So I took over the decision making part of the family and now she's happier. I'm slowly training my dad to be more assertive in the hopes he can be reconditioned to be redpill.

              [–]smallpoxinLA 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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              I can't agree more. This is especially true with women. It's also an easy way to appear like a "leader" or "someone who know what he wants" that women likes (just look at the profiles in any dating website, the sentence "know what he wants" is on 99% of the profile along with "good listener" :-). Myself, like most guys who have been raised in the 70's and have been brainwashed to death with the baby boomer, hippie, feminism BS really have a hard time with that unfortunately.

              [–]RejectionEquality 1 point2 points  (1 child)

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              On the flip side.

              Or to put it succinctly, develop a "give and take" relationship with people.

              [–]autowikibot 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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              Robustness principle:


              In computing, the robustness principle is a general design guideline for software:

              The principle is also known as Postel's law, after Internet pioneer Jon Postel, who wrote in an early specification of the Transmission Control Protocol that:

              In other words, code that sends commands or data to other machines (or to other programs on the same machine) should conform completely to the specifications, but code that receives input should accept non-conformant input as long as the meaning is clear.


              Interesting: Static discipline | Internet layer | Jon Postel | Internet protocol suite

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              [–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children)

              sorry, this has been archived and can no longer be voted on

              (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Franklin_effect)

              In short: Demanding makes people like you.
              It is absolutely counter-intuitive because we all have been socialized to do stuff for other people and avoid confrontation in order to gain their sympathy.
              This is also one of the reasons why making girls do stuff for you works and buying them drinks and flowers doesn't.

              [–]autowikibot 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              Ben Franklin effect:


              The Ben Franklin effect is a psychological finding: A person who has done someone a favor is more likely to do that person another favor than they would be if they had received a favor from that person. Similarly, one who harms another is more willing to harm them again than the victim is to retaliate.

              Image i - The eponym of the effect, Benjamin Franklin


              Interesting: Benjamin Franklin | History of American newspapers | Sam Walton | Uniontown Area School District

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              [–]drallcom3 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              I don't know what the effect is called, but you like a person more if you do him a favor. It's similar to your effect.

              [–]Johnny10toes 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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              To go along with this. I've had this conversation with my wife countless times.

              Me: Where do you want to eat?

              Her: I don't know. Where do you want to eat?

              Me: Chilies

              Her: No.

              Me: TGIF

              Her: We had that last week.

              And on and on until a place is decided.

              Now it goes more like this.

              Her: Where are you going?

              Me: Chilies.

              Her: I wanted TGIF.

              Me: Umm I guess I could eat there this time.

              Her: You can go to chilies if you want.

              Me: I know.

              The actual place is rarely important to me. The beauty here is that we didn't run through the list of possible places twice and be on the other side of town before a decision was made.

              [–]rednukleus 1 point2 points  (0 children)

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              That sounds like something to add to my frame and see how it works for me.

              [–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children)

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              Good philosophy.

              [–]Geronimo989 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              This does work with girls and children, but not with other men. I get pissed when someone tries this on me.

              [–]shooler00 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              Very good post. People who work in sales also use/should use this sort of behavior. After a test drive I like to just ask "so, are we going to look into bank financing or were you planning on writing us a check?" instead of asking them if they want the car (unless they like visibly hated the vehicle). If they really don't, I'll find out soon enough but I am framing the conversation as if the interaction is already going exactly where I want it to go. I am still actually asking a question but automatically just assuming a "yes" to the question that is actually important.

              [–]MadOgre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              Great post. Believe it or not my girlfriend was the one who gave me this advice first. I was mildly shocked. Back then I was still trying to do a nice guy routine and would always ask her to do stuff with me, and a lot of times she would just say "no". I'm not talking about something like sex, I mean something simple like watching a specific movie together. Once she said "no" too many times I confronted her, and she said "why do you ask me? Just tell me you're watching it and I'll join" and then I just started doing that. No problems ever since, still together.

              [–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              This is brilliant. Thank you.

              [–]violent_frame 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              I really live this shit. It's super powerful.

              I however suffer from leadership fatigue. I've been intolerant of a leadership vacuum since I was a tiny nerd. So when a decision is in the air I wait 2-4 breaths, and then state my decision. I always hope someone else will lead, seldom do they. I usually say something along the lines of, 'Yes, let's do it' I look around and look for nods, then I say 'shall we go?' then herd everyone along.

              [–]0ringer 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              James Marshall had a good bit on leadership. A good leader doesn't just demand whet he wants, but sees the needs of those he leads, and shows them that they benefit by following him.

              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-juyEIgwhGQ it's some time after the 45 minute mark

              So, just saying "We're going to do X" Won't always work. Women aren't lemmings.

              A better way of doing it is "I'm going to go do X, want to join me?"

              [–]Victorimax 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              This needs to be a sticky ASAP

              [–]tigolbittiez 0 points1 point  (0 children)

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              I'm just sort of browsing top TRP posts and this one stood out to me. I'm kind of indecisive, myself, and wanna run a similar experiment.

              I've always sort of deluded myself with remarks like, "I don't care what we eat or what we do this weekend."

              I'm gonna start doing this.